Mr. Spencer
I am a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.I came across this site while doing a research paper about Joseph Smith, when I came here I knew I hadn't found the right information I was looking for but I did notice the section of this site titled, "I hate to be blunt," or something. I read it and you started talking about Elohim? I have been a memebr for a long time and I have read alot of the Book of Mormon, and I have NEVER in my experiences heard any word of Heavenly Father being named Elohim, or him living on a disant planet with a father and grandfather, nothing exists of untrakable genealogy, and nothing at all exist of ANYTHING about Elohim.

Our heavenly father is just as it said at the top. Heavenly Father is wise, kind, merciful, and ruler of the all. You challenged me to prove you wrong, I now ask you where you found anything about Elohim, who told you this was what Mormons beleived? And where inthe book of Mormon have you found this? It doesn't exist, and mormon doctrine doesn't know it if it does, which means we dont beleive it.



If ignorance is bliss, you should be happy.

Here are just a few quotes from Mormon publications about Kolob and Eloheim. In the LDS Collectors Library I found 267 citations for Elohim and 84 for Eloheim.

You may also be interested in the following quotation from the man most people call the "greatest mind of Mormonism," Orson Pratt.

We were begotten by our Father in Heaven; the person of our Father in Heaven was begotten on a previous heavenly world by His Father; and again, He was begotten by a still more ancient Father and so on, from generation to generation, from one heavenly world to another still more ancient, until our minds are wearied and lost in the multiplicity of generations and successive worlds, and as a last resort, we wonder in our mind, how far back the genealogy extends, and how the first world was formed, and how the first Father was begotten Orson Pratt, The Seer, Washington D. C., 1854, p. 132.

Book of Abraham
Chapter 3
Abraham 3:1
1 AND I, Abraham, had the Urim and Thummim, which the Lord my God had given unto me, in Ur of the Chaldees;

Abraham 3:2
2 And I saw the stars, that they were very great, and that one of them was nearest unto the throne of God; and there were many great ones which were near unto it;

Abraham 3:3
3 And the Lord said unto me: These are the governing ones; and the name of the great one is Kolob, because it is near unto me, for I am the Lord thy God: I have set this one to govern all those which belong to the same order as that upon which thou standest.

Abraham 3:4
4 And the Lord said unto me, by the Urim and Thummim, that Kolob was after the manner of the Lord, according to its times and seasons in the revolutions thereof; that one revolution was a day unto the Lord, after his manner of reckoning, it being one thousand years according to the time appointed unto that whereon thou standest. This is the reckoning of the Lord's time, according to the reckoning of Kolob. Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, Section Six 1843-44 p.313

Kolob the Great Kokaubeam
Abraham 3:16
16 If two things exist, and there be one above the other, there shall be greater things above them; therefore Kolob is the greatest of all the Kokaubeam that thou hast seen, because it is nearest unto me.

Joseph Fielding Smith Jr., Doctrines of Salvation, Vol.3, p.80
Authority is an eternal principle operative throughout the universe. To the "utmost bounds" of space all things are governed by law emanating from the Lord our God. On Kolob and other giant governing stars and in the tiny electron, infinitesimally small and of which all things are composed, divine authority is manifest in the form of immutable law. All space is filled with matter and that matter is controlled and directed by an All-Wise and Omniscient Creator

Hieing to Kolob
Spencer W. Kimball, Faith Precedes the Miracle, p.51
As we stretch our imaginations to absorb the limitlessness of the creations of God we turn to a favorite song:

    If you could hie to Kolobin the twinkling of an eye, And then continue onward with that same speed to fly, D'ye think that you could ever, through all eternity, Find out the generation where Gods began to be? Or see the grand beginning, where space did not extend? Or view the last creation where Gods and matter end? Methinks the Spirit whispers, "No man has found `pure space,'" Nor seen the outside curtains, where nothing has a place. The works of God continue, and worlds and lives abound; Improvement and progression have one eternal round. There is no end to matter; there is no end to space; There is no end to spirit; there is no end to race. -- Hymns, No. 257
Bruce R. McConkie, Mormon Doctrine, p.428 KOLOB
Kolob means "the first creation." It is the name of the planet "nearest to the celestial, or the residence of God." It is "first in government, the last pertaining to the measurement of time. . . . One day in Kolob is equal to a thousand years according to the measurement of this earth." (Book of Abraham, pp. 34-35; Abra. 3:3-9.)

B. H. Roberts, New Witnesses for God, Vol.1, p.442
In this passage will be found the germ of that system of the construction and movement of planetary systems that make up the universe, set forth in the teachings of Joseph Smith. Here it may be seen that there are many great stars--the "governing ones," near together, and from among them rises one pre-eminent in greatness--Kolob--which governs all the rest that are of the same order as that to which our solar system belongs. B. H. Roberts, New Witnesses for God, Vol.1, p.442 From other fragments translated from the writings of Abraham on the roll of papyrus we learn that a star called by the Egyptians "Oliblish" stands next to Kolob--that it is the next grand, governing creation; that it is equal to Kolob in its revolutions and in the measurement of time; that it holds the keys of power as pertaining to other planets.y B. H. Roberts, New Witnesses for God, Vol.1, p.443 Another governing star in this Abrahamic system is Enish-go-on-dosh, "said by the ancient Egyptians to be the sun, and to borrow [receive] its light from Kolob through the medium of Kae-e-vanrash. * * * Kae-e-vanrash is the grand key or governing power which governs fifteen other fixed planets or stars, as also the moon (Flo-eese), the earth and the sun in their annual revolutions. * * * * Kae-e-vanrash receives its power through Kliflos-is-es or Hah-ko-kau-beam. Kli-fios-is-es and Hah-ko-kau-beam receive their light from the revolutions of Kolob. ELOHIM Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, Section Six 1843-44 p.343 In the first place, I wish to go back to the beginning -- to the morn of creation. There is the starting point for us to look to, in order to understand and be fully acquainted with the mind, purposes and decrees of the Great Elohim, who sits in yonder heavens as he did at the creation of this world. It is necessary for us to have an understanding of God himself in the beginning. If we start right, it is easy to go right all the time; but if we start wrong, we may go wrong, and it be a hard matter to get right.

Discourses of Brigham Young, p.50
I want to tell you, each and every one of you, that you are well acquainted with God our Heavenly Father, or the great Elohim. You are all well acquainted with him, for there is not a soul of you but what has lived in his house and dwelt with him year after year; and yet you are seeking to become acquainted with him, when the fact is, you have merely forgotten what you did know.

Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, Section Five 1842-43 p.237
Wednesday, 4. -- I spent the day in the upper part of the store, that is in my private office * * * in council with General James Adams, of Springfield, Patriarch Hyrum Smith, Bishops Newel K. Whitney and George Miller, and President Brigham Young and Elders Heber C. Kimball and Willard Richards, instructing them in the principles and order of the Priesthood, attending to washings, anointings, endowments and the communication of keys pertaining to the Aaronic Priesthood, and so on to the highest order of the Melchizedek Priesthood, setting forth the order pertaining to the Ancient of Days, and all those plans and principles by which any one is enabled to secure the fullness of those blessing which have been prepared for the Church of the Firstborn, and come up and abide in the presence of the Eloheim in the eternal worlds. In this council was instituted the ancient order of things for the first time in these last days. And the communications I made to this council were of things spiritual, and to be received only by the spiritual minded: and there was nothing made known to these men but what will be made known to all the Saints of the last days, so soon as they are prepared to receive, and a proper place is prepared to communicate them, even to the weakest of the Saints; therefore let the Saints be diligent in building the Temple, and all houses which they have been, or shall hereafter be, commanded of God to build; and wait their time with patience in all meekness, faith, perseverance unto the end, knowing assuredly that all these things referred to in this council are always governed by the principle of revelation. (May 4, 1842.) DHC 5:1-2.

The Discourses of Wilford Woodruff, p.335 - p.336
We thank thee, O thou Great Eloheim, that thou didst raise up thy servant, Joseph Smith, through the loins of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, and made him a prophet, seer, and revelator, and through the assistance and administrations of angels from heaven, thou didst enable him to bring forth the Book of Mormon -- the stick of Joseph, in the hand of Ephraim -- in fulfilment of the prophecies of Isaiah and other prophets, which record has been translated and published in many languages.

Harold B. Lee, Stand Ye In Holy Places, p.233-234
The participants in the formulation of this plan in the premortal world were all the spirit children of our Heavenly Father. Our oldest scriptures, from the writings of the ancient prophets Abraham and Jeremiah, affirm also that God, or Eloheim, was there; His Firstborn Son, Jehovah, Abraham, Jeremiah, and many others of great stature were there.

Encyclopedia of Mormonism, Vol.1, ADAM
Adam has been highly esteemed by all the prophets, both ancient and modern. President Brigham Young expressed the idea in 1852 and later years that Adam "is our Father and our God, and the only God with whom we have to do" (JD 1:50). This remark has led some to conjecture that Brigham Young meant that Adam, who was on earth as our progenitor, was in reality God the Father. However, this interpretation has been officially rejected as incorrect (Kimball, p. 77). Later in the same speech Brigham Young clearly stated "that the earth was organized by three distinct characters, namely Eloheim, Yahovah, and Michael" (JD 1:51). Additional information about Brigham Young's feelings on Adam can also be found in a conference speech given October 8, 1854 (JD 1:50), clarifying somewhat his earlier statement. It is there implied that through a process known as divine investiture, God delegates his power to his children. Adam was the first on earth to receive this authority, which includes all essential keys, titles, and dominions possessed by the Father (D&C 84:38; cf. 88:107). Thus, he had conferred upon him all things that were necessary for the accomplishment of his manifold responsibilities, and Adam is a name-title signifying that he is the first man and father of all.

Journal of Discourses, Vol.1, p.356 - p.357, Heber C. Kimball, November 14, 1852
I will tell you what will be good for us, and it will bestow upon us all the luxuries of this life, of heaven and earth. You are talking about heaven and about earth, and about hell, &c.; but let me tell you, you are in hell now, and you have got to qualify yourselves here in hell to become subjects for heaven; and even when you have got into heaven, you will find it right here where you are on this earth. When we escape from this earth, we suppose we are going to heaven? Do you suppose you are going to the earth that Adam came from? that Eloheim came from? where Jehovah the Lord came from? No. When you have learned to become obedient to the Father that dwells upon this earth, to the Father and God of this earth, and obedient to the messengers He sends--when you have done all that, remember you are not going to leave this earth. You will never leave it until you become qualified, and capable, and capacitated to become a father of an earth yourselves.